She Wakes | What Sits On The Throne Of Your Heart

Your life is already worship-shaped. The only question is what’s doing the shaping. Join Kelly, Jodi &  Mattea as they dive into this topic!

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Transcript

Summer Banter And Messy Memories

SPEAKER_03 0:16

Good morning. Good morning. Good morning. Happy Thursday.

SPEAKER_02 0:21

Oh, we shouldn't timeline. Oh, you know what today is, you guys? What? That's true. We shouldn't timed it. But today is the last day of school for my children. Tomorrow technically is the last day, but little half skip being in the world.

SPEAKER_03 0:33

Do you want to say that publicly that you're skipping? Yeah, it's a last day.

SPEAKER_02 0:36

Like, what are they gonna do? I don't know. It's not a full day, right? No, it's a half day. What are you doing instead? Going to the lake. Oh we're excited about getting out of town. Is it supposed to rain this weekend or real? Oh, not now. You know the weather is so weird.

SPEAKER_03 0:52

Well, I've been checking for VBS and it's raining every day.

SPEAKER_02 0:54

It's gonna that's a lie. It's gonna change.

SPEAKER_03 0:56

But it might be raining only evening. You know, well, the first day, Tuesday, says rain in the morning. Oh. So Jesus is in charge of the weather. I'm not gonna wear it.

SPEAKER_02 1:05

You know what? If it's not lightning, throw them out there. Dance in the rain. That's what we said.

SPEAKER_03 1:09

But we were like, our parents are gonna be so happy with us. It's gonna depend so on the parents.

SPEAKER_02 1:14

You can throw my kid out there. Just be like, can you bring today's field day? Okay. Yes. And so it could be wet outside. So we had to send extra shoes, extra socks.

SPEAKER_03 1:26

Oh, that's what they said.

SPEAKER_02 1:27

Yes. So I think it's appropriate to be like, send extra clothes.

SPEAKER_03 1:34

What did you guys do? Wrestling in the mud. I went to a barbecue festival in Memphis last weekend. They had, I didn't see it, but I saw listed there was barbecue sauce wrestling. Oh, does that sound disgusting? Yes. And there were men and women in the show. You know what? This is funny.

SPEAKER_02 1:53

So I mean, depending on who listens to our podcast, you might not know Jamie and I are high school sweethearts. So we dated from my sophomore year on. And our favorite thing to do. Oh gosh. My junior year, his senior year. So he had a group of guy friends, yes. Yeah. He had a group of guy friends, like six or seven, and I had a group of same six or seven girls, whatever.

SPEAKER_03 2:16

Hold on. I'm still so distracted. So you are not turning 50. No. What is that crazy face? Come on. You are not turning 50, but he is. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 2:27

I'm 13 months younger. 13? You're a baby. Yes. So young. So young. Spry.

SPEAKER_03 2:33

Okay, so back it up.

SPEAKER_02 2:34

So I don't even know how we got on to this like trend. But typically every weekend we would go out like alone one night and then the next night we'd be our friends, but you'd always end up together. Okay. Not like us, but like our friends.

SPEAKER_03 2:47

Because he was with kids out of school and you're still with kids in high school.

SPEAKER_02 2:50

Oh no, no. This is my junior year and his senior year.

SPEAKER_03 2:52

Oh, okay, okay.

SPEAKER_02 2:54

But all of my friends and all of his guy friends, we were all friends together. So we'd have to be like, where you know, I was like, where are the boys at? Which you'd actually have to physically go find them because driving around because everybody knows where everybody is now. We would end up in food fights every Friday or Saturday. Every one of them.

SPEAKER_03 3:12

What does that mean?

SPEAKER_02 3:13

I don't I think it started with TPing each other. And then the boys, of course, the boys always up it, you know. Boys can't just keep things calm. I'm gonna guess it was Pastor Jamie's idea. Oh, I'm sure. So then it probably ended up with like food on cars. Well, it ended up context food on bodies.

SPEAKER_03 3:31

Oh.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

Just outside whoever's house we were at.

SPEAKER_03 3:34

Okay, so you're not in a restaurant doing food.

SPEAKER_02 3:36

So one night we're at our friend's house, and the boys show up with eggs.

SPEAKER_03 3:40

Oh.

SPEAKER_02 3:41

And my sister gets caught and they crushed a dozen eggs on her and like mustard, ketchup. Well, then you have to get in the car and go home that way to shower up. She like was so sticky she couldn't move. Oh. So that's what I think of barbecue sauce wrestling.

SPEAKER_03 4:01

Egg whites tighten up. Maybe I should rub them on through my legs. Don't you know? Like, if your kid cuts themselves, you could put egg white on it instead of a butterfly and it'll shut up.

SPEAKER_02 4:14

Can I put that on my eyeball?

SPEAKER_03 4:16

Like all my wrinkles? You could put on your forehead.

SPEAKER_02 4:18

Botox, it's a natural Botox.

SPEAKER_03 4:20

I used to do it during quarantine, you know, when everyone was born. I put egg whites on my face. On your non-wrinkly forehead. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, but ferventing it.

SPEAKER_02 4:29

Okay, it's preventing it. Yeah, yeah. So barbecue sauce wrestling, that sounds miserable. Oh slimy.

SPEAKER_03 4:37

You're welcome for the travel back in time.

SPEAKER_02 4:41

So, but I think the kids could wrestle in mud. It'd be fine. It isn't unreasonable to ask for extra clothes. The schools do it all the time.

SPEAKER_03 4:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:51

But hopefully it doesn't work. Because it's much better if no one's wet and miserable. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:55

They won't be miserable. They'll just be able to do that. Oh, that's true. That is true. That is true.

A 1 Corinthians Summer Collaboration

SPEAKER_02 5:00

Um okay. So we are for the summer, we're doing a collab with collab. You'll hear it on the church program. So with the church podcast, which is called Life Lessons, apparently.

SPEAKER_03 5:14

Oh, it is.

SPEAKER_02 5:15

Thank you for not knowing that. Oh, I didn't know that. It's like not the it's is it new? No, I don't think. It's not the one that's the sermon, it's like the other one.

SPEAKER_03 5:26

Life lessons. Oh, yeah. Well, anyway, it's all under life community. Yeah, we are too.

SPEAKER_02 5:33

We fall into the same category. So anyway, we're doing a collab. She wakes and Pastor Jamie, Pastor Sean.

SPEAKER_03 5:41

Collab is short for collaboration. Collaboration.

SPEAKER_02 5:44

Yes. So of 1 Corinthians all summer long. And we're so that one we're walking chapter by chapter. So we decided on She Wakes that we're gonna take a topic out of a chapter. Today's topic is the whole book, technically. And then we'll spend time on that topic for the She Wakes. So just for our regular listeners, that's what we're doing.

SPEAKER_03 6:06

We're gonna be so fluent in this letter.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

I think you will be. I mean, Jody and I have spent the last semester small group studying it. Yeah. And it was so good to sit and just take a whole book. I think it's a good idea. Literally read it line by line. I do too. Repeating. I think I need the details. You know, some people don't need all the details. I need all the details. Okay. Oh, like of a story.

SPEAKER_03 6:29

Yeah. You want to hear a detail I just was looking into? Oh yeah. So I was thinking, I've just been captured by this being a letter. And like, how did mail work? You know what I mean? What? Did you look it up in your dictionary? So I looked up a couple of books and a couple of articles, and it's so interesting that, you know, this was a thing, like letter carrying. And it would have taken a week for the letter to get from Ephesus, where Paul wrote it, to Corinth. So it would take a week. And there were different, like this was a usually you would send a slave. So like we hear in chapter one that he gets this letter from Chloe's people. And so it's probably Chloe's slave. Well, what was nice about it is that whoever delivered the letter could give you the scoop. That's not in the letter. Oh. And so, like, a lot of um commentators believe that the letter did not like Corinthians did not send a letter to Paul saying, Hey, um, by the way, one of our followers is sleeping with his stepmom. You think that's cool? They're like, that was probably not in there at all. But Chloe's people were like, hey, guess what else is going on? And everybody seems to be fine with it. What do you think, Paul? And so he's like, um, and by the way, like, I don't know, was that in chapter two?

SPEAKER_02 7:53

Uh it's chapter five.

SPEAKER_03 7:57

I don't remember. Anyway, I just thought that was so interesting. So then it would shift. And then the other thing that would happen is that these letters, like, they would be read. So there weren't like a copy for every person. So you would definitely hear the letter. You would experience it, you know, by um, what do you say when you hear it by your ears? Is it orally? Yes. Aura or oral? Oral. Oral.

SPEAKER_02 8:22

Yeah. You hear it orally. You would oral is your mouth, but you're hearing it from a mouth. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:28

There might be a different word. Or just getting it. Yeah. Anyway. Um, and so you would hear the letter. That's how you would experience it, not with your eyes. And so these people, so then it would change from not just being a slave because it would get misinterpreted these letters. So that's why Paul's like, okay, that's not what I meant.

SPEAKER_01 8:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:49

You know, it's like even still to this day, we're reading these letters and people are coming up with all kinds of interpretations. And it may not be what the author intended. So then he would try, he would, Paul would send a trusted co-worker. And then letter carriers would be expected to perform the letter. So when you read the letter, you had practice, you would have your inflections, you would have your facial expressions. I was listening to Is that what Sosthenes is? Sosthenes is the carrier.

SPEAKER_02 9:21

He's the carrier. Yeah. He's not the slave, he's the coworker. Well, um I read today too. He died. He gets killed.

SPEAKER_03 9:32

Sostheny and like one of the mobs.

SPEAKER_02 9:34

Yeah. That were coming after Paul, but he falls Sosthenes.

SPEAKER_03 9:38

With like the um idol when like the they mobbed him because of the blacksmiths in the town. Maybe. I read it this morning, but I was like, oh, poor guy. Anyway, so then so then when I was read I was listening to Psalms on the Bible app this morning, and he had not practiced. I was like, your reading of the psalm is so dry and the inflection, and you know what I mean? Like it's a real thing. The other thing is um that men and women could be letter carriers. So we know that Phoebe carried the letter of Romans, and so she would have read the letter, taught the letter, if you will. So anyway.

SPEAKER_02 10:19

So she was a co-worker, not a slave. She was a coworker, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:22

So it moved on. So you could pay someone like, I need you to deliver this letter. And then it was like, okay, what if the letter got lost? What if they didn't interpret it right? It's like, you know what? I need one of my guys to deliver this letter. So anyway, I just thought that was so interesting. That was interesting. And of course, it would have been really hard, you know. So like traveling on foot, on horseback. So they would walk, they walked a week to get first Corinthians to the Corinthians. Yes. It took, it would took, I don't remember if it they considered five or seven days, but instead a week.

SPEAKER_02 10:55

I wonder how many miles you can walk in five days.

SPEAKER_03 10:57

Well, the other tricky thing is that this is a hospitality culture. Oh, true. So it's rude to just spend the night and keep going. Oh yeah. So you had to build into your trip, sticking around.

SPEAKER_02 11:09

But then also we've learned before that people didn't travel alone.

SPEAKER_03 11:12

Right.

SPEAKER_02 11:13

So they would have been more than one person of my pair.

SPEAKER_03 11:17

Yeah, so at least one person.

SPEAKER_02 11:19

Yeah. So interesting.

SPEAKER_03 11:21

But your pair might have hooked up with other pairs that were going. You know, everybody's traveling like this. Anyway.

How Paul’s Letters Really Traveled

SPEAKER_02 11:26

So we are gonna talk today. We're gonna do on the topic of idol worship, and we're doing that because it was a problem in the Corinthian church. Um, because they are ingrained in their culture. So we have pagans who become Christians, but they've lived pagan for their entire life. So letting go of that would have been difficult, and it was all still all around them. So we don't necessarily see that in chapter one, but we're gonna do it as the topic today because it's as a whole.

SPEAKER_03 11:59

You know what? I just had a thought, and this was kind of confusing for me when we were in India, Matea and I, and I've seen it before, but like the Christians, the people who convert to Christianity, but they still wear like the bindi, and they still do, you know, some of the painting on their body because they've grown up with it. It's a cultural thing. I'm just thinking, like me, I love Christ. I grew up celebrating Halloween.

SPEAKER_01 12:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:29

Like I just still kept that cultural influence, you know. And some of the people that we saw, like for me, they were kids. So they their parents like they were trying to find Jesus, but their parents weren't. So they would still show up to honor their parents' church. That kind of makes sense, though.

SPEAKER_01 12:49

Yeah, yeah. Because it would be honoring to their parents, even in today's world industry.

SPEAKER_02 12:55

Yeah. I read, so I did a a quick study this morning on the gods or the temples that you would have been in in Corinth. And so it says that the Corinthian temples, Apollo was a big one. And then I don't know if I can say his name right. Which is so funny because Apollo Asclepius. He was the god of healing, so this was almost like a ho his temple was like a hospital, like people would go and stay there. And so then in the marketplace, you would have had the temple of Poseidon, Hercules, Hermes, or is it Hermes or is Hermes? Which is injury it's also very interesting. Herme. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:38

I mean, that's what the fashion That's what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_02 13:41

I know. It's interesting. We're like, oh, Apollo. We're still. Oh, we had a spaceship named that. That's weird. Um Aphrodite, Athena, Octavia, and then South would have been ten more temples. We had Isis, um, Demeter, Anther, Anthro. Oh, oh, sorry. I can't read my own writing. You guys so stupid. It's another to Aphrodite. So Aphrodite, this is how dumb I am, and I can't, I should not write things. I should type them.

unknown 14:17

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 14:18

That's a casey move right there. And Brito. I should have just kept it on my computer. Listen, it's real life up in here. Okay. Another to Aphrodite. So two Aphrodite temples. She's the goddess of love and fertility. Um was that 10 more?

SPEAKER_03 14:44

I remember them saying there were.

SPEAKER_02 14:46

But it said it would have made it extraordinarily difficult for converts to avoid participating in idol worship. And the Church of Corinth right now, or at this time frame, is like 40 to 200 people. It's not very many people, which I don't know how big the town of Corinth is either. It's a lot, it's a few thousand, probably, I would imagine. I think we had that fact at one point when we were. But um, but it's like they're just immersed in their culture, so it would be very difficult to like pull yourself away from something that you've done forever. Like I've done it forever and now it's wrong.

SPEAKER_03 15:23

Right.

SPEAKER_02 15:24

Or now I'm aware that I'm not where I'm now I can only worship the one true God.

SPEAKER_03 15:29

Well, and the other thing is that it's a way of life. So like if you're gonna meet with people, you know, like to have business meetings or to get things done.

SPEAKER_02 15:39

Well, this is where marketplace alone was, which is four or five. That's where you're getting your marketplace. Yeah. Yeah. So it's meat sacrifice titles, which we're gonna we'll hear about later in the chapter. Yeah. Um goods, I guess. I mean, everything there, your whole life is there.

SPEAKER_03 15:54

That's where surrounded things are happening, you know, like you are.

SPEAKER_02 15:58

It's like going to like the gas station in a small town.

SPEAKER_03 16:00

What do you mean?

SPEAKER_02 16:01

Like uh or like the coffee shop. Like everyone would go there as to where I go today because I need to get food, I need to get cloth, I need to do whatever I need to get.

SPEAKER_03 16:09

Yeah. And so now you're on the fringe of society because you're not participating in all those things. So it'd be real lonely. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:19

So I wanted to know, I was like, when is the first time we see idol worship in the Bible?

Idol Worship Then And Now

SPEAKER_03 16:27

Oh.

SPEAKER_02 16:28

So I looked and I so Genesis 31, 19, we see that Rachel steals Laban's household gods. So there's so there's some household gods there. But then in Joshua 24, 2, it says that Abraham's ancestors were idol worship. So that puts it even earlier. But then I was like, this is not Chat GPT, by the way. I have a Bible study program that searches books, not the internet. So I was like, Do you think that Adam and Eve sinning in the garden is a form of idol worship? Because to me it's like the idol of self. You know, like, oh, I can I can become a god now because I can be godlike. And it agrees and said, Yes, it's definitely a form of their them being disobedient to God was a form of um worshiping themselves because I can now make myself better. I think that's not depending on God.

SPEAKER_03 17:31

I think that's the essential part of it.

SPEAKER_02 17:34

Yes. Doesn't it all come down to that?

SPEAKER_03 17:36

It all comes down to that. We might try to get there by power or money or sex, but we're just trying to put ourself on the throne.

SPEAKER_02 17:43

And when you think about idol worship, it all is wrapped in the same package power, money, sex, self indulgence, self um elevation.

SPEAKER_03 17:57

I think so often we don't think we're guilty of it though. I know. You know, like I feel like, am I trying to acquire power? Am I trying to acquire money? And you know, when I was looking into it myself, and um Tim Keller, the late Tim Keller, says a lot about idols, and he puts it into modern terms like the things that we worship because it's such a I wish there was a better word, because especially in Western culture, we are like, we don't worship idols. Yes, we don't, yeah, because we don't physically bow our bodies to a statue. But it is anything that is making a good gift from God the focus instead of God.

SPEAKER_02 18:41

Yeah. Because we also see there's a lot of sun worship, moon worship, star worship in the Old Testament. I mean today, yeah, but from all of time.

SPEAKER_03 18:49

So then a definition that he gives is an idol is anything that absorbs your heart and your imagination more than God. Well, guess what? We are all guilty of that. Whatever absorbs my heart and my imagination. I mean, I can remember being younger, and what absorbed my heart and my imagination was having a beautiful family that absorbed my heart and my imagination, having a lovely home that absorbed my heart and imagination. I mean, being um a great aesthetician that absorbed my heart and my imagination. Like that was put in place of God. God gave me a good family, He gave me a great job. And instead, I started like imagining everything about those things.

Defining Idols With Tim Keller

SPEAKER_02 19:37

It would be really hard to work in the industry you work in. Oh, and have it an idol in your life.

unknown 19:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:43

Do you have you did you struggle with that?

SPEAKER_02 19:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:46

I think so. I mean, I've always naturally been thin, and I know that a lot of women think thin is beauty. And so that wasn't the thing for me. But I think as I age, it's gotten really difficult for me because beauty is young. Like in our culture, beauty is young, and beauty is not lined, and beauty is not gray hair, and beauty is not. I mean, we are fighting that with the cheeks, with the infill, you know, the fake.

SPEAKER_02 20:17

Everything about girls now are fake. Everything we have fake eyelashes, we have fake lips, we have fake hair, we have fake nails, we I like all real life filtering. It's like it is not inherently bad. No. But when you can't look in the mirror and say, Thank you, God, for making me who I am and what I look like. Then it's like when we have to take it and change it all. I mean, I color my hair. I don't want to be ash, I would be like dishwater blonde, which is like the ugliest color hair you can have, right? So color my hair. Maybe I shouldn't. Maybe it's an idol. Maybe my blonde hair is an idol. Oh no.

SPEAKER_03 21:03

I mean, it's a big thing. It's like where's the line? Like, how do you get where's the line? But like Well, here's the line, here's the line. This is what this is what was so profound to me. This is again uh Tim Keller. He says, anything that is so central and so essential to your life that if you lose it, your life would hardly feel worth living.

unknown 21:23

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_03 21:24

I lost you. Sorry, I got it. I thought that was so profound because I talk to people and I hear from them where they have that feeling that life is not worth living. And now to realize like they have put all their hope in something. I don't see you putting all your hope in your blonde hair. No, it would be a little bit more. And that life would be a few. Life is not worth living, yeah, it will go on. You know, so that's a good test. Like, can I live my life without this thing? Yeah. And I think for me, you know, like losing a family member, then you're like, okay, I can live without this thing. Or this person, like I can, you know, so that is not an idol. But for some it can be.

SPEAKER_02 22:06

Yeah, it can be. I wrote to um because it it is, I think still in our culture today, we have a lot of sun, moon, star worship, like in the new age. And I think people will be like, Well, where does it say that in the Bible? Well, I'll tell you. In Deuteronomy 419, God warns against worshiping of heavenly bodies or worshiping uh the created things instead of the creator. And then in Deuteronomy 17, the crime for that or the sorry penalty. The penalty is death. It said take them out and stone them for worshiping. Get the evil away from you. And you had to have two or more witnesses that could not be one. And the first witness of the group was the first one to stone. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03 22:56

So you better be sure about this.

SPEAKER_02 22:58

Yeah. But could you imagine? No. You're worship I mean, you're worship being the sun and the moon and the stars, so now you are gonna die.

SPEAKER_03 23:05

Could you imagine if we did that today?

SPEAKER_02 23:07

I mean, how many of us would die? So many. I love the sun.

SPEAKER_03 23:11

It's my favorite of all creation. Kelly.

SPEAKER_02 23:14

But I did not worship it.

SPEAKER_03 23:16

Is it so central to your life that if you lose the sun, your life would hardly feel worth living?

SPEAKER_02 23:20

It might. But God made the sun for our happiness and our warmth pleasure.

SPEAKER_03 23:28

If we replace and he says in Revelation that we'll no longer have the sun because he'll be the brilliance of our heavenly bodies, which we're also gonna learn in First Corinthians.

SPEAKER_02 23:40

Um it's true, it's going to be illuminated by the Lord and not the sun anymore. No more sun. But I mean, people I was trying to like, okay, if we don't think we worship idols, what are some modern day idols that you guys think that we do? Like, we know we worship idols, right? Like everyone, I but we don't have the little gods and our we don't have these little figurines. Which is interesting. When you guys were in Cambodia, I don't know if Jem tells you this. When I have been to other countries, like when we to Guatemala or I've been to South America, they'll say, Don't buy the statues in the marketplace because they're little idols. I bought like the elephant. Oh, really?

SPEAKER_03 24:19

I did. It's in my guest bathroom. You still have it? Yeah. Jodi. I know. I prayed over it and rebuked it because it's such a cool little statue. We don't know. Have you seen it? It's like the black kind of animal.

SPEAKER_02 24:34

I was just in your bathroom. I didn't notice it.

SPEAKER_03 24:36

Is it by the elephant? Those are India. I got a lot of people.

SPEAKER_02 24:40

And the elephant is not good.

SPEAKER_03 24:43

Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:44

That's an idol too. India. You might need to get those on here. You know what? If you had some like real sickness going on in your house or something, I'd be like, you might need to get those.

SPEAKER_03 24:51

I did pray over those things. I really did.

SPEAKER_02 24:54

But I I never thought of it until I was out the show. No, I thought of it when I bought it. Oh, you guys actually have little graven images that you take into your house that you think have power. See, and though they have no power, they have power. An elephant is a real thing attached due.

SPEAKER_03 25:11

And that's what we're talking about. But as far as like um the other thing about idols, especially like going after, you know, so like think we don't think about ex you know, beyond power, money, sex. We're also thinking about looking for acceptance or looking, you know, like I'm putting all my hope in um seeking approval. Like if people don't approve of me, then you know, my value, I have no value. Um, if they don't accept me, if I can't control my circumstances, like all of those things become idols too. Yeah. And so the thing, the the deception of the idol is that it seems like if you can attain it, all's gonna be well. And as soon as you do, you're already looking to the next horizon. It won't be enough, which is why we have the porn industry. Yes. Because sex, the way God intended, like if it becomes your idol, you just want more and you want more and you want more and you want different and you want more. And it just It will never satisfy. It you can't state it.

SPEAKER_02 26:14

Yeah. Which is why God gave this marriage, by the way. I know. Work on it there.

SPEAKER_03 26:20

But I think it also can be in the church, you know. So, like, um doctrines, you know, like we believe this, and we're like, you guys don't, like, you're totally missing.

SPEAKER_02 26:29

Your denominational name. Your denominational name.

SPEAKER_03 26:32

Your political party. You've talked about this a ton.

SPEAKER_02 26:35

So here's something interesting.

When Good Things Become Ultimate

SPEAKER_03 26:37

I so like all my hopes are in this, and if it doesn't happen, I mean you know there are temples in the Old Testament or uh we're worshiping other idol gods in the old testament.

SPEAKER_02 26:48

So we have uh Baal and Asherah, which um are sexuality wands and like greater productivity, but then we have Moloch. So Moloch, you can find him in Second Kings. He's the god of the Ammonites, and they would um have their children walk through fire to sacrifice to Moloch. And so I even the king did that. Yes. So I put in my logos. Yes, my logos thing. And I wanted to know what it said about modern day Moloch worship, which I already know one of them. But what else it said was it it fascinated me because I've never thought about it this way. Sorry, I have to go ask. So abortion. I already knew that. Abortion is modern day sacrifice to Moloch, sacrifice to children. I don't know how you could think it's not, but that's vital.

SPEAKER_03 27:56

Well, and it's also worship of the self. It's like my life. So this falls into it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:01

Right? So it says rather than literal fire, modern society has refined the methods of destroying children through abortion, child abuse, and inadequate care in homes and schools. Oh when parents prioritize self-worship, their children become sacrifices on that altar. Yes. Children are increasingly viewed as inconvenience to adult schedules, interruptions to careers, costly burdens, or mistakes. I was, I've never I knew abortion. I could have guessed that one, but I was like, oh, child abuse, inadequate care, like foster care, hello. How many kids are in foster care? Because we have become so self-absorbed that the people that we bring into the world we no longer even want to take care of.

SPEAKER_03 28:52

And I can see where parents are making that their gods now. So it's like my children's sports activity. Oh, I have that on my list.

SPEAKER_02 28:59

Just your kid in general. So whether your kid is an inconvenience and that becomes the idol, so we either do away with him it completely or child abuse, neglect, whatever, or my child is my idol. Yes. Everything I do revolves around my kid. I worship this kid. I I worship this kid. And they're feelings. You know, parents, I mean, I know parents like that. Their feelings. If my kid doesn't want to do it, we're not doing it. Like the kid did takes the entire household. Totally.

SPEAKER_03 29:32

And which is a question I love to ask when parents will say that to me. I'm like, who's the grown-up in the house?

SPEAKER_02 29:38

Yes. Now this is an obvious, like it's kind of duck. Kids do need taken care of. You have Mateo has a one-year-old. I have a one-year-old granddaughter.

SPEAKER_03 29:48

You don't want to follow him. But you have you have to have eyes on him at all times.

SPEAKER_02 29:53

Yes. Right? I mean, you can't just let him out and you have to feed him and take care of everything. Every you are everything to him. Yes. And that's true, but you can also see how our kids then become they do become our everything. I mean, they are literally parts of our soul walking outside of our body.

SPEAKER_00 30:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:11

But then what happens, I think, too, and I remember very distinctively when Jake was little. I'm so scared of them dying. Like terrified. Of course, right? Nobody wants their kids to I don't know. I was not thinking about that. I was so terrified. And then I had to copy like a realization. No, just probably even as older.

SPEAKER_01 30:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 30:36

Like, God, you love my children more than I do. You created them. I'm to steward them well. But if they were to no longer be, I have they I have to be okay. Like it can't destroy my life, which a lot of times it does. And I it is like, I think we can understand that. You know, the statistics of like staying married after the loss of a child are not great. Um, and I think everyone would be like, oh, understandable. But then as Christians, I think we have to be like, are my kids an idol? And which ways are they? And then how do we rectify that in our home? Because you know what else we do then? We create little narcissists running around.

SPEAKER_03 31:22

The other thing is like, do we take this seriously? Like, that's what I love having the old and the new testament. Like, he took idol worship so seriously. Yes. Get out. You are going to be stoned. Get the evil out of your society. Oh, you've got your kid in every single program every night. What a good parent you are. And it's like, no, you need to be stoned. That's Jody Milk for you. Me and Terry are like, Jody said that. Not enough. But I mean, like, we don't have strong feeling. Just like when we talk about the gossip, you know, sin as the as gossip. And we're like, oh, well, that's okay, man. It's not, we're not murdering. We're gossiping. God says it's sin. Get it out. Flee.

SPEAKER_02 32:09

I know. I think we don't know what it really comes down to like the idol of self. Like it could all be boiled down to we all want to worship ourselves. Even when you're like, I don't, you know, I don't need attention. Like, I don't need attention. I don't need, but like, but I want what I want. But I want what I want. My will still wants what my will wants. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 32:29

You know. Which is why the Lord gave us free wills. He could have made us little robots that just we worship you, Yahweh. Putnam easier though. But instead, he's like, no, we want our kids to freely love us. Like that's a beautiful thing when we realize like they don't just love us because we're giving them their favorite food. Like they enjoy us.

SPEAKER_02 32:50

So after we just bash everyone's children, let's bash everyone's political

Politics And The State As Idols

SPEAKER_02 32:54

views.

SPEAKER_03 32:54

Okay, perfect. Because it goes on. This is going to be our highest-rated podcast.

SPEAKER_02 32:58

So also modern day Moloch worship, because Moloch was also state worship. So a deeper spiritual dynamic involves the state itself. Moloch means king or counselor and refers to the king or state worship with giving one's seed to Moloch, meaning the child becomes property of the civil ruler. The king god was regarded as the focus of magical powers necessary for the community well-being, and modern societies similarly, similarly, gosh, that's a hard word, expect the state to solve political, economic, education, medical, and cultural problems. Modern people prove far more gullible than ancient peoples in their faith that the state functions as a tree of life. Oh. Ouch. Can live, I mean, everyone, we should all be like, ouch. And I know because I told Mateo last night, I was like, we're gonna burst everyone's bubble that Taylor Swift and Donald Trump are idols. And no one's gonna like us anymore. That's true. But tell me that we can't as political parties. I mean, it's not just Donald Trump, it's political parties together. It's like if the Republicans are in office, we're all gonna die. I mean, the Democrats, we're all gonna die. If Democrats in our office, the Republicans are all gonna die. Well, guess what? We're all still here.

SPEAKER_03 34:20

We're all still here.

SPEAKER_02 34:21

And we've had bouncing around many, many, many years of turnover. And guess what? Gas prices are high, groceries are high. It doesn't matter who's in office. We've been here before. We've it's the same story over and over and over. But why do we give such a worshipful present, I don't know how to say it, to whoever is in office. Like, and I remember telling Jamie before this last election, because you we go to Branson a lot. He's Jamie's an old man, he loves Branson. I know that I'm gonna be on the tour buses of old people going to Branson one day because it's like I think it might be his highest thing he can achieve in life is going on a tour bus to Branson with old people. And we're almost old now. I mean, we have five years before we can be 55 and older group. Oh wow Jody has three. You're almost there. We could go to Branson together. That's not a bad thing, 55 and older. I'm excited to do that. I mean, 55 is like the new 45. I mean it's like the new 45. We're good.

SPEAKER_03 35:20

Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:22

But but we walk, I mean, we're in Branson, and this is uh probably after Trump's first uh four years, and now we're in the middle of and there are so many stores full of Trump. I saw them, yes, and I was like, Jamie, I saw it. Tell me he's not an idol. I mean, this is idol worship right in front of our faces, and the people that are die hard. I have a few in my family. No, he is not God. He is not the Lord, he's not the king. Listen, sorry, uh, he doesn't even follow the Lord.

SPEAKER_03 35:59

No, you guys the Lord says in Proverbs that he can guide the king's heart.

SPEAKER_02 36:04

He can't if the kings are willing to listen. For sure. I think the heart and he takes down kings. We know all of that. Yeah, God is in control, but we have got to stop worshiping the people in office.

SPEAKER_03 36:18

It is hard because you know that in the scriptures we see that when people are persecuted, the gospel flourishes. When people are persecuted and they're in the minority, the gospel spreads. And unfortunately, like when we're flourishing in a country, it lulls us into false security that we're like, okay, we're okay. Gas prices are down. We did not down. No, but I'm just saying, like, when things are you're just we think we're secure.

SPEAKER_02 36:46

Yes. You guys almost fell out of my off the seat of my car two weeks. I hadn't bought gas, like in I don't know, whatever. And so it was like almost five dollars. And I called my mom up. I was like, when did gas get five dollars? Almost fell off my car. Yeah. But then I also want to tell, listen, uh anyway, I'm not it's whatever. But you know, when Biden was in office and gas prices were astronomical, which by the way weren't this high. And then every you saw the little sticker on the gas pump with Biden with a point saying, I did that. Oh, yeah. I just want to know where the Trump ones are. Yes. You gotta be fair. I'm just saying, if Biden did it, then Trump did it. Like, that's the kind of stuff I'm talking about when you come to like some Christian, I don't want to say all of us, but Christians who have such an allegiance to who is in the office. Well, to be then you're blinded by the fact that we have $5 gas, but somehow it's not Trump's fault, but it was Biden's. Like, I'm sorry. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:49

The thing that I think is hard is that we like when you know the story of America, it does seem like God's sovereign hand was on our coming as together as a nation. Yes. And we know that when nations are benevolent, you know, like we see that with the um the mustard seed that grows into a tree and then people find shelter in it. You know, like when you are a healthy country, people can find shelter. It's a gift to the world. And so, you know, we as Christians, we do want to support things like that for the flourishing of mankind so that we can end abortion, so we can solve foster care, you know. So, like you do want to do that, but like any good thing, even if it's a good president with good policies, it can still become an idol.

SPEAKER_02 38:37

Yeah, I mean, like that, your kids are good things, can be an idol.

SPEAKER_03 38:41

Sex is a good thing, could be an idol.

SPEAKER_02 38:44

Money, good thing. You have to have it.

SPEAKER_03 38:46

Stewarding your body could be a good thing. Food, idol, totally true.

SPEAKER_02 38:51

Good and bad. Yeah. I was thinking about all the way here. We always think, you know, if people are overweight, they're like, oh, food is your idol. But healthy people, healthy meaning you are working out, the gym can be an idol.

SPEAKER_03 39:06

Totally.

SPEAKER_02 39:07

Your world revolves around your food, your workout schedule, like nothing else can budget. Like it's an idol.

SPEAKER_03 39:13

I saw that with money too.

SPEAKER_02 39:14

We don't want to think that.

SPEAKER_03 39:15

Like you could have a ton of money, and maybe you hoard it because your security is in that money.

SPEAKER_00 39:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:22

Or maybe you want a ton of money because you want to spend it so that you can look like you have all these things and raise yourself in society. So like money could be used both ways. I mean, it's really, I think, coming before the Lord and being like even people who are poor, who don't have money, all they think about and imagine that captures their heart is money. Yeah. Not having it, having it, all of it. That's a good point.

SPEAKER_02 39:44

Do you ever like seriously ask God, like, show me the idols of my life?

You Cannot Fast An Idol

SPEAKER_02 39:50

Yes. You know what? Well, Mateo has a question. I'll ask them today. I know. I think we can think, I don't have any idols. I think I do. I think I do too.

SPEAKER_03 40:00

I actually there is this, we had a conversation about um fasting at youth in our small group. And, you know, I've done a lot of research, especially when our whole church did fasting, of fasting food. How in the Bible it does not talk about like the only fasting it talks about media is food. Yeah. It's not in the Bible. And then and um a student brought up how, oh like I'm gonna fast social media, which is good. But um she the when she was explaining, she said, uh, what did she say? She said, Oh my goodness, now I have like fasting social media. What did she say? You're too young for brain fog. She didn't know. Hold on. Was she worshiping the god of another? I don't get it. You do get it. You were here a nice. Oh, oh yes, oh yes, yes, yes. Well, I'm trying to find it. Oh my goodness, why did I forget it? Okay, we'll get to the maybe it'll come back when you get to the end part. Okay. Yep. So she said, I'm gonna fast social media. Oh, and what popped in my head was oh, because she was explaining like how she's addicted, but basically she was idolizing it. And I just a little thought, which it was the Lord, popped in my head and was like, you can't fast an idol. And I was like, interesting thought. And I like prayed over that. You can't fast and I thought that word was for her. You guys don't girl, you can't fast an idol. Yeah, like you can't fast. Because what fasting is, is you give it up and then go back to it. Yes, but you can't give up an idol and then go back to the idol. Oh and I was praying and the Lord was like, that wasn't for her, that was for you. And I was like, oh I'm like, okay, what am I? And it was my phone. Oh, you know, like oh, like I can't, because I would do, you know, social media fast and and just give it up and then go back instead of learning a good balance of okay, like I can have this without making it an idol, like a kid. Like you're not gonna get rid of your kid if you're making an idol, you're gonna set boundaries. So that's I always thought that was so interesting of you can't fast an idol.

SPEAKER_02 42:27

Because that's good.

SPEAKER_03 42:28

That's you know, yeah you have to stone it, break it, break it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:32

So we didn't even talk about phone. I mean, phone the phone is so interesting too because it's generation, it's like goes across generations no matter how old. If you're I mean, if you're 90, you might not be able to see it anymore. But like my grandma has a phone, she has a Facebook page she shouldn't have.

SPEAKER_03 42:51

I mean, you guys but she can't see it anymore. You go to any public place and no one is talking, they're all sad. And you know what I've noticed?

SPEAKER_02 42:59

Like the 65-ish and olders are some of the worst. You're sitting around a table with your children and grandchildren and you are scrolling on your phone.

SPEAKER_03 43:09

Is that so new to them too? Like kind of staying in the youth generation, they grew up with always having a phone. That's true.

SPEAKER_02 43:17

I think you maybe and like Jake, that 25 and older, are the last generation that did not have electronics from day one.

SPEAKER_03 43:26

Yes, they were like coming out. I remember when the iPhone came out.

SPEAKER_02 43:29

Yeah, I mean, I think Jake was like seventh grade, maybe so everybody else has been immersed in it since they were born.

SPEAKER_03 43:38

But you can't go anywhere without no, and like I'm surprised we don't have more crime because no one's looking. No one's paying attention. They're just walking looking at their phone. You know, like how are you not taking their wallet just right out of their purse, like they're not looking?

SPEAKER_00 43:54

That's true.

SPEAKER_03 43:55

It's just like I think it's just a a comfort that. If we're in an awkward situation, you put your phone out, you don't feel awkward anymore. Or you, you know, numb. Like you don't have to think when you're scrolling. I mean, for me, relax makes me efficient. Like, okay, I got five minutes. Email, email, email. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:14

Jody Miller doesn't actually use her phone for social media scrolling. I mean, she's work. Chop that idol. She didn't even start the idol. She even started. But you know what else I think, especially for women, and this is probably where I could get caught up in it could be an idol, is like watching influencers on what you should buy. Like what's out at Target, what's out at Walmart, what's out at the way you look. Yeah. Oh, Sam's has a great sweatshirt. You have to have like the consumer portion of that idol. Like, and why? Having more does not make you happy.

SPEAKER_03 44:48

No, it's like this, you're gonna be like this. And I think that is the allure. Then you will be happy.

SPEAKER_02 44:55

And you're until I give you my next every season. You know, it's like, oh, you have to have this thing. No, you actually don't have to have that thing. No. Because it's you know, more laundry and more than a lot of things.

SPEAKER_03 45:05

It is interesting though, if you start that, you do lose the appetite for it. Yes. So, like I used to want all the time.

SPEAKER_02 45:13

Your body's going to crave what you feed it. Yeah. If you feed it sugar, you crave sugar. If you feed it vegetables, it craves vegetables. Water, it's gonna crave water. Absolutely. So if we're feeding it shopping, it's gonna crave shopping. I love to shop. I actually like to go out. I don't even have to buy anything. I like to go out, walk around, look at some of these. I know it doesn't that compute in my mind, actually. I have a few other friends who are like, I hate to shop. I don't like to shop online because it's too but it's like, you know, some websites are hard. I don't know. I just want to go to the store. If I don't if I don't see anything, whatever. Yeah. I don't know. Old school. Old school type of paper. Old school. I want to go. I want to read a book with papers.

SPEAKER_03 45:54

My friends, he's like, I'm going shopping. I'm like, you're not going shopping. If you were going shopping, you were gonna buy something. Go. Oh, you're just gonna go. You're just walking around to look at things.

SPEAKER_02 46:03

Oh, I see what you mean. Like when you do physically go.

SPEAKER_03 46:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 46:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:07

And then we leave. I'm like, okay, now I feel like we did not accomplish it.

SPEAKER_02 46:10

Shopping, Jody.

SPEAKER_03 46:11

I don't like it.

SPEAKER_02 46:12

It's togetherness. It's like going on a walk. Yes. Get some coffee, walk in the gap, go to alternate states, see what they have. You're not gonna buy anything because it's too expensive.

SPEAKER_03 46:22

We've already determined it's a good idea. Sale previously priced. Sale. I always go on the sale rack. And I've only been 50% off the sale rack, even better. We've already determined that's not how we're supposed to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_02 46:32

But you can tell the consumerism, I feel like, from the like when I was a kid, you know, which was I'll be 49 in July.

Consumerism Trends And Beauty Pressure

SPEAKER_02 46:39

So it's been a bit. But when I was a child, when my mom and dad would go, we would go shopping to the mall, but it was probably once, I mean three times a year. I don't know. Not often. Yeah. You had one pair of shoes. We did not have a closet full of clothes and drawers full of clothes. Like we did not have that. You had a few outfits that you wore on rotation. Oh yeah. And then my kids, my big kids, my girls had more clothes because it's more fun to buy for girls. But still, even like they didn't have multiple, they didn't have a ton of shoes. But now my seven-year-olds, which I don't buy them a lot of shoes because they trash them, so I just let them trash them and then I buy a new pair. But I don't where did it somehow, some between the last 48 years, it switched from where you had what you needed to abundance. And it's like, if you don't have all of it, what we're not good enough? I don't even know what I think. That's exactly it. I don't feel like I'm not good enough, but I do want to show you.

SPEAKER_03 47:38

So and so has these shoes. So and so is that.

SPEAKER_02 47:47

Well, I'm not, I don't wear any socks. Very rarely, if I have tennis shoes on, I don't have socks on. I'm not changing. So then we have skinny jeans. Well, those are out. Now you need wide leg jeans, but those are kind of out, so now you need like flared legs. Like so they do that to you so you can keep up with the trends, but it's really oh yeah, it's really just an idol.

SPEAKER_03 48:06

In 2010, Uggs, big thing. Uggs are coming back, and then canceled. Flip-flops.

SPEAKER_02 48:11

We just talked about flip-flops coming back.

SPEAKER_03 48:13

Oh yeah, they left. Well, it was like the big Ug.

SPEAKER_02 48:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 48:17

Now the short Uggs are in oh good.

SPEAKER_02 48:19

I have a picture. I think the tall ones are coming back with the tall socks. What? Tall, like the taller ones, like with the bows at the back. Tall socks, like they might be making a comeback. Oh, but now we talked about this today too. Not you guys, Casey and I. Hollister. Everything in Hollister right now is 2000s. Like I owned all of it. I mean, I don't own all of it, but I owned a lot of it. Baby Dell tops. I wore those when I was pregnant. So now that I see them in a store, I'm like, pregnant is anybody wanna wear that? That was like the maternity clothes of the 2000s. It's coming back. What's happening? With a two-way zipper and all of it. Oh, yeah. And the little, yes, the mini skirt, jean mini skirt, two-way zipper. The fur hood came back. Oh, yeah. Layers. Yes. So the beauty industry. I mean, we're just immersed in idol worship. Is really what it is.

Practical Ways To Break The Spell

SPEAKER_03 49:10

If you drop out of that, there's so much freedom. So much freedom.

SPEAKER_02 49:16

Give us some practical practical advice on how to drop out. And this is coming from someone who works in a salon.

SPEAKER_03 49:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:22

Beauty, you work to make people beautiful.

SPEAKER_03 49:26

I mean, I still want to have beautiful skin. And you like nice clothes.

SPEAKER_02 49:30

I do, but I drop them on a um smaller scale.

SPEAKER_03 49:34

Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 49:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 49:36

I mean, I rent them per se. I do rent them. The thing is, is you just, I think it's really social media. It's consuming like these pictures that keep flashing in front of your brain, like, you should wear this, you should wear this, you would love this, you'd look good at that. And I can remember, you know, like so if I'm so I don't have social media like that, but I see women in my in the salon all the time. And if I focus on one thing and I'm like, oh my gosh, like for instance, right now on my screensaver, if you look at my pages on my phone, there was a girl that I was in class with, she had a pair of shoes on, and I'm like, I want those shoes. And I just keep looking at them and the desire grows. And I'm just like, I really want those shoes. And I look again and I'm like, you know, but so like I finally I did I delete it? I finally did just close. I'm like, I'm not getting the shoes. I decided. And so I'm not obsessing about those shoes. But if they would constantly be flashing in front of my feed, then I like would not feel contentment until I possessed them.

SPEAKER_02 50:42

Don't you feel I mean, this is untrue because God is the hope. But for teenagers, maybe even like younger than my 18-year-old. Do we have any hope for them? Because the statistics show that they're just laying in bed when they don't have school. Even when they do have school, eight hours a day, ten hours a day, twelve hours a day. Scrolling TikTok, scrolling Instagram, scrolling, like I think they don't know how to turn it off.

SPEAKER_03 51:14

I think the hope is a church.

SPEAKER_02 51:16

The hope is a church, but when the people in the church don't also turn it off, where is our at least they're coming?

SPEAKER_03 51:21

Who are the and they're interacting, and if we get them plugged into serving, like they're having to see people eye to eye, they're having relationships, they're having access where I can say, Hey, get off your phone, you know, like relationships. If you don't have that, no one else is telling you to do these things. That's so true. Caleb and I, we were talking to a bunch of youth kids coming up with summer ideas, like, hey, what what should we do outside? And nobody was gonna none of them could give us. They're like, uh, what do you do outside? We're like, oh my goodness, it's the outside.

SPEAKER_02 51:55

I don't even want to be in my house. I only want to be outside. Me too.

SPEAKER_03 51:58

I'm like, what should we do? And they just could not help come up with I know you make them be more helpful. You know what to do out. Let's go back to the 90s.

SPEAKER_02 52:08

Take their phones away. But you know, here else too, where we get, I think, a parental trap that we can get into is that if you would take all those phones away, you would have a few parents psycho about it. How dare you take a little bit of a phone?

SPEAKER_03 52:23

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:24

I can't get access. They don't have access. I don't know where they are. They're like, oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03 52:28

Remember back in the day when you had to drop your kid off?

SPEAKER_02 52:30

And then you pick them up where they were. I mean, you took them there.

SPEAKER_03 52:34

Like going to nine, and they're like, Can I like will I be able to talk to them? Like, can I call them each day? No. I said yes. You did? I said yes. On your phone? On my phone. I said, I definitely in my room. Listen background. Guess what? We're gonna FaceTime you.

SPEAKER_02 52:50

Maybe like I'm old. Like, maybe I'm old school.

SPEAKER_03 52:53

You don't want to hear from them.

SPEAKER_02 52:55

Your kids are fine. Oh, for sure.

SPEAKER_03 52:58

They're fine. But that's what I'm saying. It's not the kid, it's the parents.

SPEAKER_02 53:01

But some but okay, yeah. So what are we we're doing our child a disservice that they can never be out of our sight. Let them live freely. That's a disservice. I mean, they're gonna be like I'm a 90s kid. We raise ourselves on the streets. Our moms kicked us out in the morning. Do not come back until the streetlights are off.

SPEAKER_03 53:22

That was probably the last time I went shopping at Kmart.

unknown 53:25

Oh, Kmart.

SPEAKER_03 53:26

Walking around to love Kmart putting layout. Yeah, oh yeah. See, Idol worship lay away.

SPEAKER_02 53:34

Oh but you know, like par, I mean, parents are built different these days.

unknown 53:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 53:38

Their kids are not out of their sight.

SPEAKER_03 53:40

But the hope is the church. It really is. Yeah, we're not letting or like Jordan Peterson. He's telling young men to like get out of bed, make your bed function, be a part of the world. You know, I mean, there are some people who are understood. Have a job. But it's because they're older, because they're like they remember a time when people spent it outside. And you know what else?

SPEAKER_02 53:57

Like, we're actually built, we're created to be productive.

unknown 54:02

We are.

SPEAKER_02 54:03

We're created to be produced. We're creating a community car. Yeah. Be a community. Be the people. And if we don't have it, get your hands sturdy. Like, and this is what's good for your brain. Like, God didn't give us those things like you're gonna till the land. I mean, it was, you know, part of the then the fall, you know, part of the fall. But also, He knows we need purpose, but it's also good for us. It's good to be able to do it.

SPEAKER_03 54:24

But before sin, we were working. Yeah. Like we had working. It's good to have jobs.

SPEAKER_02 54:28

It's good for your mind. Heaven is where it's good for your soul. It's good for your body. Like God gives us those things not as punishment, but as these are actually really good gifts for you, and it's a benefit to your life. Yeah. Yeah. So slay all your idols. I wouldn't say the Holy Spirit will be a good one.

SPEAKER_03 54:43

Or will come stone you.

unknown 54:46

Yeah.

Celebrity Worship And Church Influencers

SPEAKER_03 54:47

I wanted to add one more story about um having celebrities as your idols. That couple years ago I saw this video of these two girls at like um, I think it was Billie Eilish concert, and their hands were up and it looked like they were worshiping. And if you changed the auto audio to a worship song, it looked like they were worshiping. It was insane.

SPEAKER_02 55:14

I mean, think about concerts.

SPEAKER_03 55:15

What do everyone does they were doing to them? I guess. Yeah, you know, like I love this. You know, you just still know what to use your hands. But and I mean, they're basically worshiping her, but I think they're just so like fangirl that you're like, well, like you know what? This is a cry. I was a crier at concert. I know you're in my pets the other day. I couldn't believe it. This is but the back we were made for. Like I remember remembering this in our my last classes. This is what we were made for. And so the new secular worship is concerts, is going to museums, is going to be not new, right?

SPEAKER_02 55:57

We had um Athens. I mean, you had the games, like they worshiping the body, worshiping the body. They were nude.

SPEAKER_03 56:05

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 56:05

Yeah, it's been around. I mean, I that kind of I remember this was years ago, and it was a girl that went to church here, and she was really she loved music, she loves worship. And this is kind of duh, but Satan was is the angel of worship.

SPEAKER_03 56:22

Music, yes.

SPEAKER_02 56:23

So he like it's an angel of light, yeah. And it's no wonder why we have satanic, like mu the music industry is so dirt, so dark, yeah, and so much abuse and all the things that come along with it. Yeah, and then it was just like he was beautiful too.

SPEAKER_03 56:40

It's like, oh well, so catchy, so nice, you know, yeah, and even our Christian artists, they can be idols. Oh, absolutely. And pastors? Absolutely. Idols. Pastors' wives, absolutely, not this one.

SPEAKER_02 56:56

I give you nothing to worship about. But maybe I feel like, hmm. Is there a pastor's wife that's an idol we can think of? I don't know. Uh Tammy Faye Baker.

SPEAKER_03 57:06

That are probably influencers.

SPEAKER_02 57:09

Oh, influencers.

SPEAKER_03 57:10

That are pastor wives that now are on social media. Yeah. You know, there are some on Karygma, they have a good following. You know, people might have looked Lisa Harper, people probably idolize her. Oh, that is true. Of like Beth More and her words. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it gets to a dangerous part that you're like, if you stop reading and praying on your own and only listening to podcasts, only listening to sermons, and like and it's one of those, like, I mean, I do this sometimes that there's some people I don't even know, but I like their, you know, their beliefs, what they say. And if they say something, I kind of trust amount of and there's other people that I'm like, hmm, I'm gonna double check that, I'm gonna triple that. And so I feel like you have to kind of be careful in that way too. Just because you don't like someone doesn't mean what they have to say is and the people that we idolize, quote unquote idolize are still human.

SPEAKER_02 58:12

Like we're still make mistakes. We're still wrong. They are going to fail you. Yes. So knowing scripture for yourself is so important. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 58:21

What I was gonna add to what you said earlier, Matea, about um you don't fast and idol, you know, some of those things that are good things, like your kids, like coffee, like food or exercise. That's why a fast is so important to be able to starve that, to check in with yourself. Is this am I a slave to this?

SPEAKER_01 58:47

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 58:47

Do I have to have alcohol to get through the day? Do I have to have smokes or whatever it is? Do I have to have my child and everything? Or can I live without it? Like that's a good way to like check your check your engine, if you will. You know, so like those good things that you can't get rid of, like your kids. Yeah. You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 59:11

Can I go around without makeup on?

SPEAKER_03 59:14

Nah. I don't have much on today, but I can you?

SPEAKER_02 59:17

Yes. Would I come to church on a Sunday morning without makeup? Absolutely not. Really? Because that's an idol, probably. Nobody wants to see it. I think it's caring for your neighbor. It's Christianity at its best.

SPEAKER_03 59:35

What's wrong with you? Are you sick?

SPEAKER_02 59:37

Oh, I do love my idol of makeup worship.

SPEAKER_03 59:41

Are you tired? No, I'm just not wearing mascara.

SPEAKER_02 59:44

Thanks. Seriously, dude, you guys, I'm calling Pastor Sean out. Do you know how many times he said that to me if I come in the office?

SPEAKER_03 59:50

Oh, he does me all the time. Every time I don't have mascara on, he's like, Oh, you don't sleep all last time. Like, I slept on makeup. Oh, guess what? He's never said it to me. You know why?

SPEAKER_02 59:59

You always wear mascara?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:00

I always wear makeup.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:01

I feel like when I first met you, I would see you without makeup on a lot of times. Because I was younger. Your skin's like perfect. I was younger. Jody Miller is my idol. I need to stop. Oh no, but I last time I told you now we have some great. You might as well just say, you look so ugly today. Like, do not tell a girl they look tired. Just don't say it. Don't say, How are you today? I'm so glad you're here. That's all we need.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:29

You can say I didn't sleep well.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:31

That's why I look tired. I'm not sick. I just didn't wear makeup.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:34

What's your excuse?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:35

I have no tan. The sun hasn't shined in 45 days.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:38

Like anyway. But I think there's a good balance of not idolizing someone, but having them maybe as a role model, you know, as uh I mean, we even see in 1 Corinthians of multiple times.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:52

Paul says, model me as I model Christ. Yes. It doesn't mean Paul was perfect, but he was pursuing Paul. He's also gonna tell you we're pursuing Christ, we're not pursuing Paul, we're not pursuing Apollos, we're not pursuing pursuing Peter. We're gonna see that and so always go back to it's only for Christ. If it's for anything else, it's just for not. And that's why we have so I feel like too, is like we have so many Christians walking around broken, depressed, sad, unhappy. Like, why are we like we should not be that way?

SPEAKER_03 1:01:27

That's why it's their heart and their imagination. They can't live without that thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:31

It's yeah, and then you're like it seems so easy to say your focus isn't on God. It seems like a little cliche, maybe I guess. But really, your focus isn't on God.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:41

You know

Psalm 23 Focus Shift And Prayer

SPEAKER_03 1:01:42

what? Can I tell you a true story? Yeah. Tuesday, I was feeling so overwhelmed, and just like, I am not a detail girl, and so right now I am just like, and people say like you have a job and you love 80% of your job, and like 20% of it you hate. Well, the 20% I hate, I'm doing right now. It's like all the details of VBS, all the details of camp, all the details of you know, June schedule, all the details, and I'm just like, my soul's being sucked dry. Yeah. And I was doing a facial, and the Lord just gently reminded me, Psalm 23, the Lord is your shepherd. You have all that you need. He lets you rest in green meadows, he leads you along peaceful streams, he renews your strength. And I was like, and I said that to myself the rest of the day. Not a single circumstance had changed. The details are all still there for me to detail, to deal with. But all that changed was my focus. Even though I'm a Christian girl and I say my focus is on him, my focus was not on him. I was idolizing all the things they were sitting on the throne of my heart. And when I shifted my gaze, he literally renewed my strength for the day. And he let me rest while I was working. It was a miracle. I love that. It was beautiful anyway.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:09

Um, do you want to say that one more time is our prayer? Really? Uh-huh. Yeah. Maybe people need to hear that again.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:15

Okay. Well, first I want to ask Heavenly Father, I pray that this day, our listeners, ourselves, that you will bring to our mind what it is that is sitting on the throne of our heart that we cannot imagine living without. And so, God, would you reveal it so we can remove it from the throne, stone it to death, replace you on the throne of our heart where we will live and flourish. So will you bring that to our mind? Lord, you are our shepherd. Oh my gosh, I just lost how it starts now. How's it go? You are our shepherd. You have all that we need. You let us rest in green meadows. You lead us along peaceful streams, you renew our strength. Even though we walk in the darkest valley, we will not be afraid because you are right beside us. Your rod and your staff protect and comfort us. Father, you are our good shepherd, and we raise our eyes to you and receive life. We bless you, we worship you in Jesus' name. Amen.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:35

Amen.